This is a young woman with no other interests in life, except for worshipping an old prisoner? What kind of life is that? This is a very, very sad thing to witness. I can see the older man doing this, because he knew Manson back in the day, but what about this girl? She so desperately wants to recreate something that is long gone.
Hello everyone! Good to see you. Welcome Ruby & AustinAnn74. I think I'll just call you Austin. LOL.
Johnny! Good to see you man! :)
Adam, Bobby, Stormy, Mr. P....good comments all around!
>>>Johnny said: what is the relationship between Star and Greywolfe?>>>
I'm told they live together. I'm assuming they are doing that to support Manson. Don't know what else they're doing. LOL.
>>>Adam said: It's freaky how much Star reminds me of Sadie.>>>
I was thinking the same thing. She does look a lot like Sadie, even without hair. LOL.
>>>Bobby said: She is only in it to save ATWA from all us evil polluters and meat eaters. lol. Grey wolf: I would say is in it for Star just like Manson.>>>
You hit the nail on the head there Bobby, as usual. When an old man hooks up with a young woman, we really don't have to scratch our heads and wonder why. I mean...come on....but when a young beautiful woman hooks up with older men, we always think it has to do with money. But these two don't have any....so I don't get the attraction.
>>>Stormy said: I did the same thing but it came out looking like an addition sign "+"
People now think i've added myself into society. Oh well, back to bed.>>>
Stormy! Well that's two out and one back in. HA HA HA!
I honestly thought this chick would tire of this stuff and move on, but evidently she is as entranced as the young girls 40+ years ago were with this guy. I really don't get the attraction at all. He wasn't good looking then, and he's just plain repulsive now.
I wonder if he orders her to service this Gray Wolf guy. Sounds like old times...eh? HA HA.
Well I have to say Gray Wolf didn't have to do a whole lot of shaving on his head. Nature already took care of most of that. LOL.
Gray Wolf. Now that's a fitting name if I ever saw one. :)
Stormsurge said: "I did the same thing but it came out looking like an addition sign "+". People now think i've added myself into society. Oh well, back to bed".
look at the two of them. the ears, the eyes, etc. she looks like a younger female version of gray-wolfe.
btw, i love the vibe of this blog. very welcoming.
PS: I hope folks are reading the Shreck book (the new one) as there is a whole lot to digest. and it isn't a pro manson book :) just thought I would get that out there LMAO
If any of you people want to learn about this case, reading books that someone wrote isn't gonna get it.
You have to read the facts....police reports, trial transcripts, depositions, autopsy reports..that's where the truth comes in. Just remember this...the facts are facts...you can find these on many websites.
You can read some dreamy book by some guy that makes up all kinds of shit and believe it, but if you read the facts, you will know it's nonsense.
I've read 4 books on this subject: Helter Skelter, The Family, Manson in his Own Words (yawn) and Greg King's book on Sharon Tate. Well actually 5...that OTHER book. Yuck.
Of the 4, I love all but Manson in his Own Words. Bored me. Manson is a liar.
Oh, that's right. I'm too verbal. HA HA
Anyway, if you want to form an intelligent opinion, you have to read the facts, not just someone's convoluted opinion of rumors.
katie you make a great point. the police reports are valuable. just reading the second labianca report i am amazed at his financial condition, etc.
i can see how rosemary would have been reluctant to give him money as he would just gamble it away.
what i really want to see is rosemary's financial statements or tax records. to have made that much money from her businesses/stock market investments is unbelievable. a dollar then is at least 6 today. the market was not nearly as dynamic back then and it would be hard to amass that kind of cash.
katie8753 said... If any of you people want to learn about this case, reading books that someone wrote isn't gonna get it.
You have to read the facts....police reports, trial transcripts, depositions, autopsy reports..that's where the truth comes in. Just remember this...the facts are facts...you can find these on many websites(END QUOTE)
POIROT REPLIES:
Mt fav transcript id the 4 pt transcript court testimony by Tex Watson which is still over at Marker Turner's CharlesManson.com site. It is utterly chilling. The role od belladonna introduced by Paul Watkins. The exedus of Watkins and Poston and attempted exodus of Watson. If you stayed past May 69 at Spahns you were doomed to Hell forever. The incidiousness of Charlie's designed mind control plan is fabulously descibed by Watson in court.Nevermind Sadie and Ronnie Howard or Linda Kasabian. It was Warson's testimony that cemented Helter Skelter as Charlie's grand murder madness behind the butchery.
The 4 pt testimony is riveting.
For example: Tex was beeping at space aliens inside a Van Nuys jail under belladonna and gets beaten senseless by three convicts who think he's insane. While inside the Tate house Watson also started beeping at aliens as he murdered the Tates.
strange how other people close to Charlie like Ansom 13, Carol ( Jewel), etc never shaved and X'd their heads...and Charlie says now for all the colors,,, he included Sadie katie and leslie in those colors at one time...sounds like he is reverting back in time...or just testing people
charlie is the master manipulator. A theory I have is that he knows these folks need to feel like they're doing something important, being a part of, so I suspect he gives them color names, orders them to be chaste and wear robes or shave their heads and carve X's into their foreheads. I believe it just perpetuates their remaining in is service because now they got something that sets them apart, sets them up as special and sets them as important in his eyes. Maybe like a pimp buying one of his ladies a special thing then she gushes over it and redoubles her loyalty to him.
As Katie says, you gotta look beyond one source of information to get to the nub of the case.
I like that point how Charlie tries to make them feel important and special by doing things as an act of solidarity like shaving the head. I recall Stephanie Shram on Brian Davis's show talking about how she got a ring from Charile. Well, not reaaalllly a 'ring' more like a 'hose clamp' LMAO. That show is on podcast.
On Sunday Night, 8 pm eastern, Brian Davis is going to host a show with Scott Michaels of Findadeath.com
I am all for ATWA saving the Earth, however Ive never actually known what the "non-profit" ATWA does -the statement says donate but really what is any of the money donated used for? Internet? Star's rent? phone calls from prison? trying not to be snotty but I've just really wondered if it is documented anywhere what these donations all go for...
Hi Johnny. If you have the time, read the 1st & 2nd Cielo homocide reports and the 1st & 2nd Waverly homocide reports. It's a lot to get through but there is so much info on these reports. You will learn things you didn't know, and you will probably start researching all the questions you'll have.
Years ago there was a website called MansonFamilyToday.com run by Bret. It was a wonderful place to go hang out and read everything you could possibly want to. I wish it was still available. But there are still websites who have some of the info he had.
Yeah Stormy. Charlie does know how to manipulate. He's been doing it for a long time now.
Candy, I was wondering the same thing. Does this Star have a job? If not, how does she pay her rent, etc? Donations???
hey Katie I agree with what you said about reading those reports you mentioned. great stuff. i would really like to get to the interviews and polygraphs performed. I know that a few are out there like Garretson and Polanski, but I would like to get the one done on Amos Russell (sebring's butler), charlene Mcaffrey (sebring's secretary-girlfiend of joel rastau), etc etc etc It's like Lays potato chips, you can't just read one without wanting more original source material.
Give me Rosemary's tax returns for the five years preceeding her death and you will be able to see if she made that fortune from skillful trades/investments/business or was it under the table off the books. That is a big question right there and will tell you how she made her dough.
That's a good question Johnny. I wonder if the LaBianca's tax returns were ever examined in this case.
Rosemary had a lot of money. Supposedly she made a lot of money from her boutique and thru wise investments. But, if she was into something illegal, I wonder if tax returns would even be accurate.
I'm guessing that Rosemary kept her money separate from Leno. She never paid off his debts so I'm assuming he couldn't get his hands on any of her money.
In 1970-71 to self-mutilate and for a women especially to shave their heads WAS a HUGE statement of "giving up-x'ing from society", nowadays self mutilation tattoos brandings, shaved heads ( all the movie stars do it, alot of friends family of cancer patients do it etc) however a ceremonial gesture I dont surmise it will "catch the attention of the media" or as paul fitzgerald claimed they did this to burlesque what the media did to Charlie-not sure the reason here-to say its for all the colors- well we know violet susan ( which manson said he never cared for lost her shape), pat(yellow) who left his loyalty, lesie(green) who also did Brenda(gold) who also left silver cappy ( mayeb a friend/supporter) kat lady ( kitty) gone-Lyn RED with new man Blue with new man-very interesting why suddenly this happens
Katie I agree with a lot of what you are saying. If we looked at her business and personal tax returns then we can readily see if it supports the kind of wealth she is credited with at the time of her death. Same thing with her profit and loss statements, balance sheet, etc (all of that may be part of the police records and stored someplace). And while people will under report income to a certain extent, we would still be able to get a clear idea of the likelihood of her being able to generate that kind of cash flow.
If we got a look and saw her businesses were what you would expect for their size and scope (and everyone expressed surprise she had so much money in less than a decade) and that the 'wise investments' in playing the stock market a cover story then you have to ask how in the heck she made such a fabulous sum of money.
I am not saying it is impossible for her to have a fabulous sum of money I would just like to see the proof. The market back then was not nearly as dynamic as it is now. Tax rates were higher.
As for her and Leno's debts, she probably didn't want to throw good money after bad unless she felt that her back was against the wall.
Maybe Star has been eating Belladonna root? That's what sent Tex and Brenda off their rockers. That stuff grows by the waterfall. Can you believe it? An hallucenigenic drug that freely grows at a hippie commune? If that ain't adding gas to the fire! Naturally it was Paul Watson who finds it first. Figures. It was all over after Belladonna entered the picture. I think it's roll in crazing Tex Watson is underestimated. Remember that chick in Manson73 who knew Sadie at prison was laughing at how crazy Belladonna will make you. Tex even added Speed to heighten Belladonna's effects.
Johnny I agree. If you look at the first homocide report, you'll notice that both of Rosemary's children were suspects. Suzanne & Frank both had been in trouble with the law. Rosemary & Suzanne were at odds because of Suzanne's boyfriend, Joe Dorgan. Rosemary didn't like him.
I would think that if, at the time of Rosemary's death, she was worth $2,000,000, they would look into her financials looking for "murder for profit" motive.
I was looking for the trial transcript of Rosemary's partner in the Boutique Carriage but can't find her now. Does anyone know where that can be found?
Regardless of where Rosemary got that kind of money, it went to her children, as far as I know. That's $1,000,000/each, less taxes. A WHOLE lotta money back in 1969!!! LOL
and lets not forget that frank was 15 at the time of the murders, so he would have been pre teen and early teen during this time Rosemary was making all of this money. maybe they had a maid and someone to watch frank during this timeframe. but if she was doing all the usual mother/housewife work AND able to run a couple businesses AND play the stock market successfully all I gotta say is she was a helluva time manager.
>>>Johnny said: A million dollars back then equates to about $6 million today.>>>
Exactly Johnny. I don't rule out the "murder for profit" motive in this case. Rosemary was threatening to cut Suzanne off financially if she didn't quit seeing that boyfriend.
Suzanne works in a restaurant making $1.20/hour plus tips. California is an expensive place to live. Rosemary's helping her make ends meet.
They fight and Rosemary's threatening to cut her off.....
I don't know if Rosemary had a maid or not. Frank certainly didn't need a nanny at 15.
And Rosemary most surely had an accountant to do her financials.
Lynyrd even Charlie said he never saw Tex in his right mind again after Tex ingested Belladonna. If Charlie thinks you're crazy that is high praise. Tex was looking pretty rough at the end. Remember that Tex was one of the "expendables". Belladonna will ruin your mind. The rage and murders began after Belladonna entered the picture. Perhaps Paul Watkins really left Spahn's because of the entrance of Belladonna?
Does anybody know if a pic exists of the cabin Tex built for Manson in late 68 which Tex drew on a map as being across the highway from the boardwalk at Spahn's?
For some unknown reason Manson told Tex to stop working on it in Dec 68.
"July 29 - TONIGHT - Tate-LaBianca Radio Program - 8p ET - We will catch up with Scott Michaels founder of Dearly Departed Tours which features the Helter Skelter Tour. Michaels donates five dollars of each ticket from the Helter Skelter Tour to The Doris Tate Crime Victim Foundation, (iCan) a California-based lobby and crime victim’s organization focusing on victim’s rights and criminal legislation. http://www.dearlydepartedtours.com/helter-skelter-tour.htm"
I was watching the women volley ball yesterday, and those girls are amazing to watch. They're all extremely fit, they work together like a well-oiled machine, and after every play they come together for a "group hug", whether they score or not. Soooo cute!!! :)
I know I beat this angle to death, but I still think about Manson sitting in his cell 23 hours a day, intelligent enough to realize that next to Hitler his face is probably the second most infamous face of evil for the 20th Century. And Charlie is sitting there thinking, what the hell did I do to deserve this shit. As impossible as it is for most of us to accept, Manson just might be able to convince himself he is not responsible for the horror Tex and the girls did. So all he feels he is guilty of is wounding a drug dealer and slashing a friend. And yet EVIL is his name.
Point being in regard to the subject of this thread, maybe Charlie wants to go out with a bang. What was that comment he made in one of his interviews...."maybe I should have killed five or six hundred then I would have really done something (paraphrased)". Maybe his two most devoted followers X'ing themselves out isn't just a lark. Maybe Charlie's got one more "fuck you" to society in him and has talked Star and Grey Poupon into doing something. Would any of the old gang help out??? Cappy? Brenda? A little bella donna, Clem?
Tom said: "I would rather they legalize torture, which they aren't very far from doing by the way, than listen to a woman who is trying to be rational".
I'm with ya Bro!
You've already got one fantastic quote in the sidebar. I'm inches from adding that one too! LOL
Katie said: "I was watching the women volley ball yesterday, and those girls are amazing to watch. They're all extremely fit, they work together like a well-oiled machine, and after every play they come together for a "group hug", whether they score or not. Soooo cute!!! :)"
Yeah... I'd give my left arm, to be part of one-game's-worth of "group hugs" with those chicks! LMAO!
TomG said: "Well for $20 dollars I have Pizza and wings delivered to my door. And Olympic Games on my Vizio Big Screen TV. I like horseteeth. But not for 249.99. Girl gone wild. What gets in the head of bitches?"
Ahahahaha
I've been trying to answer that question for 25 years!
Lynyrd if you liked that volleyball, you oughtta watch today's event...beach volleyball.
The girls are wearing bikinis, it's 2 girls on 2 girls, instead of "group hugs" they do "girl on girl" hugs, and sometimes they hit each other on the butt. LOL.
Katie...we go round and round with the mindlessness of TLB, my take is that the "lure of evil" can never make sense to those who don't experience it. There are dozens of books written on Hitler's pull, how he was able to attract and maintain fanatical followers. We tend to be dismissive of Manson's abilities since he can come across as such a comical and inept con man. But the man had/has abilities to charm and seduce people. If they had only had a volleyball court at Spahn, maybe the family could have worked out their issues that way. Just kidding of course. Who isn't in favor of female butt slapping.
Leary one big difference about Hitler is that he used the fact that the German people were suffering, miserable and broke and convinced them that he could change all that. Then when things started changing for them, they were convinced that he was some kinda super hero.
Charlie gathered his herd in a different time. I just don't get why rich young girls would chose to live at that fly-ridden ranch and be treated like hookers.
Katie spot on a heckuva interview with a wonderful guest. even Scott will admit he is not 'the expert' on this stuff but he provides an interesting perspective. he probably has spent more time at the sites than anyone.
speaking of great interviews, we want to hear your show soon Katie!!!
for the record, brian's show continues to grow. moving forward. all are welcome to have a say. i hope everyone from all sides who listened to the show recognized that tonight.
>>>speaking of great interviews, we want to hear your show soon Katie!!!>>>
You're so sweet. Thanks so much!!!
>>For the record, brian's show continues to grow. moving forward. all are welcome to have a say. i hope everyone from all sides who listened to the show recognized that tonight.>>>
I'll double that in spades. Everyone is welcome. There are a lot of Anons who don't speak I hope they do next time.
Johnny I appreciate your participation on this blog, and your continued interest in the Star City Radio broadcast.
I know I don't say it enough, but I love you guys!!!
Does anyone know if Star communicates with Red and Blue and maybe Cappy? One "insider" told me Red has no problem with Star being there in Charlie's life, but somewhere I read Charlie said Star is who he wants to be his wife and his is other half of his Soul ( I always thought RED was!)...
an interesting question, Candy. I have always wondered about communication amongst Family members. Do Gypsy and Grogan, who have a kid together. right?...do they stay in touch? Of course many folk would say it is none of our business who stays in touch, and I suppose that's true. But as been said before, these people made themselves public figures so in many ways they abdicated their right to privacy. Plus some of us are just to damn curious.
katie: there is a FAcebook community called "The ENERGY OF THE MANSONS" it posted a quote of Charlies about Star how he wants to make her his wife and she is the other half of his soul...let me check if tis still posted there...Ive heard this before from one of Star's "ex" friends he told me the same thing and some other stuff which I wont devulge here...
Wow! That's interesting stuff Candy. I never heard that before....
Leary I've wondered the same thing. Do the family members stay in touch. I can't imagine being involved in something that "tight and intense" back in the 60's and then never communicate again.
um IM not able to find it now it began with something like "after 43 years of prison charles manson has found love and a quote of CM about how he feels about Star then says the rest is private,,,,it may have been removed by now not sure who knows if its real info or not I dont even know who runs this energy of the mansons community to be honest I just joined it few mos ago
Brian Davis's radio show had close to 500 listeners last night. Right at server capacity which is why the sound cut out. And actually that is good news. Over the last couple weeks a real momentum has been building.
Regarding Lynn (allegedly) getting replaced by Star:
Kinda sucks, 'cuz Lynn Fromme has always been my favorite.
I always found it oddly fascinating... (in a completely bizarre sorta way)... that Manson and I, both chose the same girl. LOL
Lynn deserves to be number one... she's been loyal for decades.
And Now... after all these years... Lynn's been "dethroned"???
Wow... I guess Lynn "went and got old, on him".
AC... is this true? Does Manson trade-up to younger women... (just like superficial "piggies" do), when his ladies get old? Is Manson now hung-up on physical appearance like Hollywood and television?
well one of stars "facebook" friends ( i wont name now) had a lengthy conversation on his page with monkeyboy ( james robinson) and theyboth talked how charlie is smart he wont take these old lady groupies he wanted soemone "fresh" ( guess what fresh means?) and monkeyboy went on to say ya I thought leslie VH was the best looking manson girl star has surpassed her anyone who thinks these dudes cares or give a fuck about ATWA is lying we all know better get real
Candy said: "In 1970-71 to self-mutilate and for a women especially to shave their heads WAS a HUGE statement of "giving up-x'ing from society", nowadays self mutilation tattoos brandings, shaved heads ( all the movie stars do it, alot of friends family of cancer patients do it etc) however a ceremonial gesture... I dont surmise it will "catch the attention of the media".
I agree Candy.
Self-mutilation (in one form or another) is common-place these days... and there are several popular hairstyles out there, that are much more bizzare than the Sinead O'Connor skinhead look. It's all been done before... and it's all been done, to death.
Heck... there are plenty of folks on facebook alone, who look more bizarre than Star and Gray Wolf. LOL
Bottom line: A person must go to pretty extreme lengths to "stand-out" now-a-days.
Us TLB enthusiasts are "titillated" by this sorta stuff... (and of course, the underlying message and significance of the "X", can not be ignored). But... the vast majority of our general public, do not follow this case regularly... and to those mainstream folks... two freaks with a shaved head, and an "X" on their skull, is not a big deal.
I highly doubt, this bizarre display will command much (if any) mainstream media or public attention.
'Course, if 500 folks "carved and shaved" (LOL)... that might grab media attention, and start folks, asking questions. LOL
Any online Manson groups wanna initiate a "Mass Carving" on a large scale? LOLOL
LYnard I as someone who came upon reading Helter Skelter maybe 30 yrs ago wrote to LYn talked to here on the phone and I forever grateful I did learn to appreciate ATWA the joy of growing my own food etc and appreciate our natural resources did put an X on my head several times as they heal fast and now and then a hippie will see it and say oh no:( so Im not diminishing its initial statement by far merely pointing out in this time it might go unoticed undesereved of the meaning because so many are tattooed shaved et al I realize it IS a big thing for any woman wo cut her hair off grey wolf well I mean he was bald anyways not much of a sacrifice for him at least maybe more so for *
katie8753 said... Johnny that's great news! But I hope we don't have trouble in the future with audio. Does Brian know how to fix that???? July 30, 2012 4:19 PM
Well Katie, to quote Richard Dreyfus in the classic scene from Jaws, 'We'll need a bigger boat." Which means Brian will have to allocate more space to that server. A pleasant problem to have. Too many listeners...
Thanks Johnny. That is a pleasant problem to have.
Last night in the chat room I was talking about Jay Sebring's house and wanting to see the interior.
Anyway, other people expressed an interest, so I wanted to post a link to a thread I did on Jay, which includes a video explaining that Paul Bern built that house for his bride Jean Harlow, then died shortly thereafter. By suicide...or whatever.
Strangely Jean died at the age of 26...same age as Sharon.
Anyway it's the 4th thread down on this link if anyone's interested. The 1st video on the thread is the one about the house.
all this talk of star replacing squeaky got me thinking. Didnt she finally "denounce" Manson a year or so before she got out of jail? And i believe Sandy did too in recent years. That leaves cappy as the only member of the old family that still would be considered a supporter, and im not sure about that even. Has there been any interviews or anything at all with squeaky since she got out. Ive been waiting not so patiently to hear what she has to say these days. also ive been going in the radio show chat room the last few weeks too. i couldnt register under andy so im in there under herp3 (my email) seems like a friendly bunch for the most part.
Hi Andy. I hope you are joining us in the chat room on Sunday night during the broadcasts. I'll be looking for you. :)
I honestly don't know anything about Squeaky or Sandy, where they live, what they think of Manson...I'm not even sure what color goes with what girl. LOL.
It would be interesting to know what ALL the girls think of Star.
Katie that's always been my question, how much do the girls interact with each other at this point? tied forever by their actions 4 decades ago...what would happen if they found themselves in a room with tex, bruce and charlie. would they all revert back to their former roles? or has 4 decades erased all of that.
surely they have visitors that pass info between them... or at least did for many years.
and now with their parents gone, what kind of relationship do they have with their siblings...what happens when they call their relatives.
'hey mom, it's Aunt Leslie on the phone calling collect, do you want to take the call?'
Johnny there's GOT to be a lot of resentment that Leslie & Pat have for Charlie & Tex.
How much does it suck that those 2 girls have been in prison all these years and the other girls have done their prison time for whatever reason and they're all out now. If I was Leslie or Pat, I don't think I would have a kind word for ANY of the other family members. LOL.
katie8753 said... Johnny there's GOT to be a lot of resentment that Leslie & Pat have for Charlie & Tex.
How much does it suck that those 2 girls have been in prison all these years and the other girls have done their prison time for whatever reason and they're all out now. If I was Leslie or Pat, I don't think I would have a kind word for ANY of the other family members. LOL. July 31, 2012 9:49 AM
Or when they hear about Clem out and playing Club Dates...since the mid 80's.
I have a feeling it has been the subject of more than one talk...probably hear a bit of: Wanna Make Ya Holler from those two girls.
Pat, Leslie & Sadie all listened to Charlie's orders from Squeaky, Sandy & Gypsy...shave your head, carve an "x", wear girly dresses, stand up and start singing during court session, laugh at the testimony about murder, fire your attorney, hire this attorney, on my cue stand up and spread your arms and act like you're being crucified, threaten the jury with their own children killing them.
The girls on the sidewalk during the trials, praising Charlie, threatening people, acting crazy.
But in the end, all those girls are free but Pat & Leslie. Sadie's finally free cuz she croaked.
All the other girls are free to have children and grandchildren, enjoying life and acting like nothing ever happened.
Pat and Leslie will never have children or grandchildren.
Their time is gone. I'll just bet there is a lot of "teeth gnashing" about that.
I just wonder if they ever send Charlie poison pen letters.
i'm sure some of the family that has been free all these years carry a lot of guilt about what they were involved in all those years ago. for some its probably a deep dark secret they've hidden from family and friends. can you imagine going through life with that kind of secret in your past,just waiting for the day that it pops up and bites you hard on the ass like it did with steve grogan?
Pat and Leslie today, I am almost sure, are pro social.
Many crimes are committed by teenagers who feel they are bulletproof, perhaps personal fable....they can't imagine a world that goes on without them.
But upon maturity, the early 30's, they realize the unspeakable tragedy of the act they committed.
They are more remorseful and spiritual than you and I probably know. Time in a penitentiary leads to much reflection and reaching out to God as they understand.
The sum of a human life is not defined by the worst act they committed.
i remember reading somewhere (maybe helter skelter) that the raid on spahn ranch was filmed as some sort of training tool for the cops....i'd love to see that. the films probably forgotten in some dusty lapd file cabinet.
Hey everyone, This is off the current topic but Star is kinda hot in a plain Jane sorta way. i'd romp her. And she does look very similar to sadie.....weird. But why in the hell would they shave their heads and x themselves 43 years after the fact. Fuckin' loons. But they say crazy girls are the best in the sack so if grey wolf is feeding star the high hard one, I bet he's loving it.
i know that gypsy sent leslie a letter stating that she knew the role she had played in leslie's life. i think she does feel guilty for bringing leslie to the family. gypsy also brought linda to manson and probably felt very guilty when she was still with the family.
I suspect that Manson idolizers like Star actually contribute to the fear society has against releasing any of the core killers to TLB which literally insures the continued inprisonment of possibly patolable inmates like Leslie.
Anotherwords, do we really want more Stars in the world? The idolitry to the Manson evil is something the parole board considers. Stars subversive, bizarre behavior doesn't help Leslie.
bobby said...>>>>> i think shes hot with hair but with her head shaved shes scary looking
I'm with you on that one Matt. reminds me too much of a Nazi camp victum.<<<<<
I feel the same Bobby. She looks like a Nazi victim. And i think she's wasting her life. Anyone know anything about her background...her parents and family?
I hope without too many regrets, she makes her way back to reality one day. And maybe when she's 40 or 50 years old and Charlie is long dead, she'll get herself to a plastic surgeon, have that x filed filed off her pretty face and begin using her skills and dedication for a cause other than Charlie Manson.
What do these people use for money? How do they support themselves? Social security, welfare, donations? Just wondering...piggie that i am and all, according to Kermit/Jim.
Her coloring isn't as fair, but Star with long hair reminds me of Sondra Locke. Late 70's Sondra Locke...when she hooked up with Clint Eastwood.
Hi Marliese. I was wondering the same thing about Star. I have no idea where she even came from, if she has parents, if she's "missing", if she works, how she and "that man" pay the rent and bills, etc.
She is a pretty girl, but she's terribly misguided. If I was looking for a sugar daddy, I'd make sure he at least had lots of "sugar" to dole out. LOL.
Katie said>>>>>She is a pretty girl, but she's terribly misguided. If I was looking for a sugar daddy, I'd make sure he at least had lots of "sugar" to dole out. LOL.<<<<<
Bobby you can see from his art work his music he was very intelligent and handsome I doubt he would have grabbed leslie if he thought she was some ugly gal just my opinion
In an early interview, bobby admits to being with several of the girls...they were awfully cute and i slept with a lot of them...if not those words, close to it. I'm sure he was...with most of them. Well maybe not Pat or the vd soaked Sadie. What anyone found attractive about sadie with her rotten teeth and moustache is beyond me. I guess maybe cause she'd probably do anything...anything at all, no doubt.
But Horseface thought of herself as 'Bobby's girl'..at least she said so once in an interview...but if i had to make a wild guess, i'd say he didn't give a hoot about her and cared more for Kitty. But what do i know.
>>>Candy said: weird everyone calls LULu horseface she must have had something that she was Bobbys girl cus he was the most handsome of any guys even charlie>>>
I call her horseteeth because she has big teeth like a horse. It's especially noticeable in her older pictures because her skin has receded and her teeth show more. LOL.
Horseface's skin looks terrible, at least in the parole hearing photos...drugs, sun, decades of cigarettes, institutional food, no supplements, poor skincare etc...I do think it's ridiculous the women can no longer use make up or hair coloring in the prison...but neither can Rosemary LaBianca or Abigail Folger and Sharon Tate.
I'd guess by this time, those things are probably not high priorities for Horseface...imagine she'd just like a little freedom.
ok katie I however am no raving beauty sao I think its kinda tasteless to make of peoples looks Id hate to have someone decipher me they would probably say much worse
Katie, I have to correct you on something. Paul Bern did not build the house for Jean Harlow. He'd built the house a year or so before their marriage. I think he built it in 1930. The original house didn't even have a kitchen because he didn't like to smell food cooking in the house. It was built with only one bedroom because he considered himself to be a bachelor. Jean did not like the house. For one thing, she thought it was too far out in the sticks, she preferred city life. (why is the theme from "Green Acres" now running through my head??)
Personally, I LOVE that house and if I ever win the lottery, I'm telling the owner to name his price and we will have an LSB get-together at my place! :-)
Katie, if I win the lottery, you and I will have a slumber party to check out all of the house's nooks and crannies so we can give proper tours to the rest of the gang.
From all of my research on the house, it wasn't really remodeled before she moved in. By most accounts, she rarely stayed there, she stayed in town at another house which was on Club View Drive. At least, that's the address that pops into my mind.
Sam Marx wrote a great book about the death of Paul Bern which has a great description of the house's interior. He was in it while it was being built and during Paul's lifetime plus he was one of the ones who helped with the cover-up following his death.
(I feel another thread coming on between the 2 of us.......)
>>>Katie, if I win the lottery, you and I will have a slumber party to check out all of the house's nooks and crannies so we can give proper tours to the rest of the gang.>>>
HA HA HA. You are definitely on girlfriend!!
>>>(I feel another thread coming on between the 2 of us.......)>>>
Jay was living in the house before 1967 tho. Some say he moved in in 1960. Supposedly, he and Cami lived there together. I've also heard that he'd bought it in 1963.
>>>Bobby said: I cant beleive I couldnt get more than a yawn from Tom G when I posted this info. It is current Manson ideolgy that clearly demonstrates his racist views.
Is that the problem, current proof that Mansons's racism wants the America of slaves to win out over America post slavery is to much of a contraversy ?
He is teaching a young recruit like Star that Slave America was the good America, then Abe came along and ruined it.>>>
Baby, we all know that Manson is a racist. If anyone doesn't know that, they need to go back to Grade 1.
Bobby, everyone knows that Star is, how shall I say it...less than smart...to listen to Charlie.
I don't know how else to say it. I can't put it any nicer.
She's evidently a girl who just glommed onto a notorious killer and wanted a name for herself.
It happens all the time. Look at all the others...Ted Bundy...Richard Ramirez....Scott Peterson....OJ Simpson....Machine Gun Kelley....Tex Watson...Bruce Davis....Bobby B.....the list just goes on and on.
There will always be women out there who glom onto killers because they don't have a life.
BTW, Tex's wife left him, Bruce's wife left him, and I think Bobby's wife left him too.
Let the record speak for itself.
And Star is no different....
So please don't bother yourself with such nonsense. It doesn't change anything....It is what it is.
Yes Katie I read your critique. it was more interesting than Staman's book. It's been a long time since I've read a major publication that was that bad. Truly a disgrace for a major publisher to print such fabrique'. A book like Staman's is bad for stores like Bookamillion and BarnesnNoble. Bad for business is what Restless Souls is.
this is what i know about star--- her real name is afton burton and she is the oldest of four. she grew up in illinois. her parents are religious and conservative. she was a sunday church attender. she had to sneak around as she was expected to spend most of her teenage years in her bedroom. at age 16 she recieved from a friend a piece of paper with manson quotes on it. she started writing manson and is now his lead cheerleader.
katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand
katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand
>>>katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand>>>
Candy, your language is enough to out you. You continually mis-spell words!!!
And your point is what?
I already acquiesced to the fact that I had the wrong avatar. You're beating a dead horse.
You and yours are still stupid....
Sorry I can't help you get smarter...not you nor your girl Starr.....Getty-up. HA HA.
Candy I wish I could teach you how to speak the King's English, but I can't because you're tongue-tied by some barrette that you've embedded in your flesh.
You are one of those unintelligible freaks that posts on these blogs.
Bobby, I am confused. Shaving your head & making yourself look like my dog's scrotal sack = saving the earth from polluters? How is that going to save the earth from polluters? Is she going to stuff all the hair she shaved off herself, and stuff the world's factory and sewage discharge pipes?? Do pubies count?
Well the judge didn't grant the mistrial plea, so it's full steam ahead. That guy's gotta be guilty. 1 wife accidentally bashed her head open in the bathtub and another wife just vanished. Hmmmm......
Katie, all I can say for sure about Jay's house is that it was part of his estate and was sold after his death. He clearly owned it at the time of his death. I don't kow exactly when he moved in. I've seen it reported as anywhere from 1960 to 1963. He clearly lived in it when he started dating Sharon because she had that spooky experience there, remember?
Bobby you're right. Manson is clearly a racist. He had this whole baloney story that he fed his followers back then the blacks would be too stupid to rule the world. And he didn't like Shorty's wife because she was black.
Bobby when you said that about the Washington/Lincoln voting on that website, I went over there to see it, and I saw that stupid statement about how these two were "honored" that Manson requested that they mutilate themselves and I was too disgusted to read further.
If anyone sends money to Manson they're not too clever. There's an old saying "a fool and his money are soon parted". I think that covers it. LOL.
katie: the reason I wanted to email you waas to mention some things I didnt want to post in main until I had some confirmation and wanted your opinion...insofar as the KIngs English not sure where that came from...and Star Ive never met her in my life nor spoke to her I guess only person I know of who has is AC
Candy with all due respect that should be afforded to any blogger, I really don't understand what you require of me.
You made a comment that I don't know anything about this case, and then you make another comment wanting my opinion. That doesn't make any sense to me.
I can't e-mail you because I don't know your e-mail address, an issue that I already went over. Moreover, I have no information about Star because Star is some girl who decided to follow Gypsum for reasons unknown.
I haven't followed this segment because it doesn't interest me...PERIOD. It has nothing to do with solving this case. If aspects of this case don't interest me, I don't follow up on it.
I don't know how to make that more clear. I won't e-mail you. Please stop asking me to.
201 comments:
1 – 200 of 201 Newer› Newest»If THIS doesn't bring Saint back, nothin' will!!! LOLOL
He's been tryin' to save that poor little "Star" for 2 years now! LOL
well 'X' does mark the spot.
i thought the 'X' statement was passe about 40 years ago...
A woman HAS to be beautiful, to look good, even with no hair.
Star is one of those women, who can pull it off.
Whoa! Better hide the buck knives, nylon rope and bolt cutters. LOL.
Omg! Isn't this a sign to the prison!? If I were a guard there I'd say "I think you're done here".
I bet ole Charlie was laughing his a$$ off at them and saying "those idiots will do anything I say".
Poor lost souls :-/
what is the relationship between Star and Greywolfe?
This is a young woman with no other interests in life, except for worshipping an old prisoner? What kind of life is that? This is a very, very sad thing to witness. I can see the older man doing this, because he knew Manson back in the day, but what about this girl? She so desperately wants to recreate something that is long gone.
JOHNNYSEATTLE!!!
RUBY!!!
AUSTIN-ANN-74!!!
It's freaky how much Star reminds me of Sadie.
I did the same thing but it came out looking like an addition sign "+"
People now think i've added myself into society. Oh well, back to bed.
OO-EE-OO!
Hello everyone! Good to see you. Welcome Ruby & AustinAnn74. I think I'll just call you Austin. LOL.
Johnny! Good to see you man! :)
Adam, Bobby, Stormy, Mr. P....good comments all around!
>>>Johnny said: what is the relationship between Star and Greywolfe?>>>
I'm told they live together. I'm assuming they are doing that to support Manson. Don't know what else they're doing. LOL.
>>>Adam said: It's freaky how much Star reminds me of Sadie.>>>
I was thinking the same thing. She does look a lot like Sadie, even without hair. LOL.
>>>Bobby said: She is only in it to save ATWA from all us evil polluters and meat eaters. lol. Grey wolf: I would say is in it for Star just like Manson.>>>
You hit the nail on the head there Bobby, as usual. When an old man hooks up with a young woman, we really don't have to scratch our heads and wonder why. I mean...come on....but when a young beautiful woman hooks up with older men, we always think it has to do with money. But these two don't have any....so I don't get the attraction.
>>>Stormy said: I did the same thing but it came out looking like an addition sign "+"
People now think i've added myself into society. Oh well, back to bed.>>>
Stormy! Well that's two out and one back in. HA HA HA!
I honestly thought this chick would tire of this stuff and move on, but evidently she is as entranced as the young girls 40+ years ago were with this guy. I really don't get the attraction at all. He wasn't good looking then, and he's just plain repulsive now.
I wonder if he orders her to service this Gray Wolf guy. Sounds like old times...eh? HA HA.
Well I have to say Gray Wolf didn't have to do a whole lot of shaving on his head. Nature already took care of most of that. LOL.
Gray Wolf. Now that's a fitting name if I ever saw one. :)
Stormsurge said:
"I did the same thing but it came out looking like an addition sign "+".
People now think i've added myself into society. Oh well, back to bed".
LMFAO!
Stromsurge, is one hilarious bastard!
look at the two of them. the ears, the eyes, etc. she looks like a younger female version of gray-wolfe.
btw, i love the vibe of this blog. very welcoming.
PS: I hope folks are reading the Shreck book (the new one) as there is a whole lot to digest. and it isn't a pro manson book :) just thought I would get that out there LMAO
On a serious note:
I'd love to know what Van Houten's thoughts would be, if she came across Star's shaved/"X"ed photo.
DejaVou?
Disgust?
Laughter?
Hi Johnny...
We'll get to Schreck eventually.
At 1,000 pages... I'm kinda pacing myself, on the idea! LOLOL
It's daunting... : )
Starship... Ol' buddy... Ol' Pal:
Do you perchance have 6 months of free-time available to read and review a 900 page book? LOL
"X"
(this is Lynyrd crossing his fingers, that Starship says "yes"...) LOL
she'd probably say
'Wannabe"
Hey Lynyrd
1000 pages is nothing for someone who can play a couple hundred chorus of Freeeeebryd man...
cue in guitars
One of the keys to sussing out this book will be to get the documents he references throughout to verify.
Let's see now, why did I even bother with that post over there? I don't remember. People don't like to be questioned. HA HA
Well I got to thinking today, something new.
At least I think it's new. Maybe I should Google it for the next 48 hours back to 1969 to make sure it's new. HA HA.
On August 9th, when the news reports came out that Garretson was arrested at Cielo Drive, did anyone at the ranch mention that?
I mean did Tex say to Pat "I thought you said no one was in the guest house".
Or did Charlie say to Tex "I thought you killed everyone there. Did you leave a witness?"
Or did Charlie say "maybe they'll blame it all on him".
Has anyone seen this?
I don't follow people around. I just ask questions. Some questions I ask can't be answered.
If any of you people want to learn about this case, reading books that someone wrote isn't gonna get it.
You have to read the facts....police reports, trial transcripts, depositions, autopsy reports..that's where the truth comes in. Just remember this...the facts are facts...you can find these on many websites.
You can read some dreamy book by some guy that makes up all kinds of shit and believe it, but if you read the facts, you will know it's nonsense.
I've read 4 books on this subject: Helter Skelter, The Family, Manson in his Own Words (yawn) and Greg King's book on Sharon Tate. Well actually 5...that OTHER book. Yuck.
Of the 4, I love all but Manson in his Own Words. Bored me. Manson is a liar.
Oh, that's right. I'm too verbal. HA HA
Anyway, if you want to form an intelligent opinion, you have to read the facts, not just someone's convoluted opinion of rumors.
katie you make a great point. the police reports are valuable. just reading the second labianca report i am amazed at his financial condition, etc.
i can see how rosemary would have been reluctant to give him money as he would just gamble it away.
what i really want to see is rosemary's financial statements or tax records. to have made that much money from her businesses/stock market investments is unbelievable. a dollar then is at least 6 today. the market was not nearly as dynamic back then and it would be hard to amass that kind of cash.
katie8753 said...
If any of you people want to learn about this case, reading books that someone wrote isn't gonna get it.
You have to read the facts....police reports, trial transcripts, depositions, autopsy reports..that's where the truth comes in. Just remember this...the facts are facts...you can find these on many websites(END QUOTE)
POIROT REPLIES:
Mt fav transcript id the 4 pt transcript court testimony by Tex Watson which is still over at Marker Turner's CharlesManson.com site.
It is utterly chilling. The role od belladonna introduced by Paul Watkins. The exedus of Watkins and Poston and attempted exodus of Watson.
If you stayed past May 69 at Spahns you were doomed to Hell forever.
The incidiousness of Charlie's designed mind control plan is fabulously descibed by Watson in court.Nevermind Sadie and Ronnie Howard or Linda Kasabian. It was Warson's testimony that cemented Helter Skelter as Charlie's grand murder madness behind the butchery.
The 4 pt testimony is riveting.
For example: Tex was beeping at space aliens inside a Van Nuys jail under belladonna and gets beaten senseless by three convicts who think he's insane.
While inside the Tate house Watson also started beeping at aliens as he murdered the Tates.
strange how other people close to Charlie like Ansom 13, Carol ( Jewel), etc never shaved and X'd their heads...and Charlie says now for all the colors,,, he included Sadie katie and leslie in those colors at one time...sounds like he is reverting back in time...or just testing people
charlie is the master manipulator. A theory I have is that he knows these folks need to feel like they're doing something important, being a part of, so I suspect he gives them color names, orders them to be chaste and wear robes or shave their heads and carve X's into their foreheads. I believe it just perpetuates their remaining in is service because now they got something that sets them apart, sets them up as special and sets them as important in his eyes. Maybe like a pimp buying one of his ladies a special thing then she gushes over it and redoubles her loyalty to him.
As Katie says, you gotta look beyond one source of information to get to the nub of the case.
I like that point how Charlie tries to make them feel important and special by doing things as an act of solidarity like shaving the head. I recall Stephanie Shram on Brian Davis's show talking about how she got a ring from Charile. Well, not reaaalllly a 'ring' more like a 'hose clamp' LMAO. That show is on podcast.
On Sunday Night, 8 pm eastern, Brian Davis is going to host a show with Scott Michaels of Findadeath.com
http://www.starcityradio.com/tlbradio.html
I am all for ATWA saving the Earth, however Ive never actually known what the "non-profit" ATWA does -the statement says donate but really what is any of the money donated used for? Internet? Star's rent? phone calls from prison? trying not to be snotty but I've just really wondered if it is documented anywhere what these donations all go for...
Hi Johnny. If you have the time, read the 1st & 2nd Cielo homocide reports and the 1st & 2nd Waverly homocide reports. It's a lot to get through but there is so much info on these reports. You will learn things you didn't know, and you will probably start researching all the questions you'll have.
Years ago there was a website called MansonFamilyToday.com run by Bret. It was a wonderful place to go hang out and read everything you could possibly want to. I wish it was still available. But there are still websites who have some of the info he had.
Yeah Stormy. Charlie does know how to manipulate. He's been doing it for a long time now.
Candy, I was wondering the same thing. Does this Star have a job? If not, how does she pay her rent, etc? Donations???
hey Katie
I agree with what you said about reading those reports you mentioned. great stuff. i would really like to get to the interviews and polygraphs performed. I know that a few are out there like Garretson and Polanski, but I would like to get the one done on Amos Russell (sebring's butler), charlene Mcaffrey (sebring's secretary-girlfiend of joel rastau), etc etc etc
It's like Lays potato chips, you can't just read one without wanting more original source material.
Give me Rosemary's tax returns for the five years preceeding her death and you will be able to see if she made that fortune from skillful trades/investments/business or was it under the table off the books. That is a big question right there and will tell you how she made her dough.
That's a good question Johnny. I wonder if the LaBianca's tax returns were ever examined in this case.
Rosemary had a lot of money. Supposedly she made a lot of money from her boutique and thru wise investments. But, if she was into something illegal, I wonder if tax returns would even be accurate.
I'm guessing that Rosemary kept her money separate from Leno. She never paid off his debts so I'm assuming he couldn't get his hands on any of her money.
Hi Candy and Nuts!
I have no idea, how ATWA donations are used... or, if there is any written record available.
Anyone?
A 503c nonprofit would have to keep records.
hi Lynard love your blog:)
Hi all! Make me gag! Revolting old pimp with his hands on a young woman... and such a protective pose too...like she's pregnant with his baby.
No different than his girls 40 years ago...malnourished looking with a carved up forehead and a shaved head.
What a stupid girl.
In 1970-71 to self-mutilate and for a women especially to shave their heads WAS a HUGE statement of "giving up-x'ing from society", nowadays self mutilation tattoos brandings, shaved heads ( all the movie stars do it, alot of friends family of cancer patients do it etc) however a ceremonial gesture I dont surmise it will "catch the attention of the media" or as paul fitzgerald claimed they did this to burlesque what the media did to Charlie-not sure the reason here-to say its for all the colors- well we know violet susan ( which manson said he never cared for lost her shape), pat(yellow) who left his loyalty, lesie(green) who also did Brenda(gold) who also left silver cappy ( mayeb a friend/supporter) kat lady ( kitty) gone-Lyn RED with new man Blue with new man-very interesting why suddenly this happens
Hi Marliese! Good to see you!!
Thanks Candy. Interesting info. :)
Katie
I agree with a lot of what you are saying.
If we looked at her business and personal tax returns then we can readily see if it supports the kind of wealth she is credited with at the time of her death. Same thing with her profit and loss statements, balance sheet, etc (all of that may be part of the police records and stored someplace). And while people will under report income to a certain extent, we would still be able to get a clear idea of the likelihood of her being able to generate that kind of cash flow.
If we got a look and saw her businesses were what you would expect for their size and scope (and everyone expressed surprise she had so much money in less than a decade) and that the 'wise investments' in playing the stock market a cover story then you have to ask how in the heck she made such a fabulous sum of money.
I am not saying it is impossible for her to have a fabulous sum of money I would just like to see the proof. The market back then was not nearly as dynamic as it is now. Tax rates were higher.
As for her and Leno's debts, she probably didn't want to throw good money after bad unless she felt that her back was against the wall.
Interesting commentary, Stormsurge.
Hi Lady Noel!!!
Hi Marliese!!!
I don't feel much regarding Gray Wolf.
I mean...
At his age, he can carve and shave whatever the hell, he wants... who cares.
"There's no fool, like an old fool".
As for Star... it's more sad, than anything.
Hi also, to Adam, Bob and Poirot!!!
I missed you guys up there!
What the hell is wrong with people? And from whence do they take that leap from law abiding citizen to vicious criminal?
If you can answer that question for me, to quench my enduring need to understand my fellow human being.....
I will buy you a steak dinner at American Cut, Revel Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City!
Maybe Star has been eating Belladonna root? That's what sent Tex and Brenda off their rockers. That stuff grows by the waterfall. Can you believe it? An hallucenigenic drug that freely grows at a hippie commune? If that ain't adding gas to the fire! Naturally it was Paul Watson who finds it first. Figures.
It was all over after Belladonna entered the picture. I think it's roll in crazing Tex Watson is underestimated. Remember that chick in Manson73 who knew Sadie at prison was laughing at how crazy Belladonna will make you. Tex even added Speed to heighten Belladonna's effects.
Johnny I agree. If you look at the first homocide report, you'll notice that both of Rosemary's children were suspects. Suzanne & Frank both had been in trouble with the law. Rosemary & Suzanne were at odds because of Suzanne's boyfriend, Joe Dorgan. Rosemary didn't like him.
I would think that if, at the time of Rosemary's death, she was worth $2,000,000, they would look into her financials looking for "murder for profit" motive.
I was looking for the trial transcript of Rosemary's partner in the Boutique Carriage but can't find her now. Does anyone know where that can be found?
Regardless of where Rosemary got that kind of money, it went to her children, as far as I know. That's $1,000,000/each, less taxes. A WHOLE lotta money back in 1969!!! LOL
>>>Tom said: What the hell is wrong with people? And from whence do they take that leap from law abiding citizen to vicious criminal?>>>
I'm not sure what you're referring to, but I'll be glad to dine with you at American Cut, Revel Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City...
And I like my T-Bone medium rare. HA HA.
A million dollars back then equates to about $6 million today.
A heckuva lot of money to amass.
If you get any of the financial statements, business records, etc let me know.
and lets not forget that frank was 15 at the time of the murders, so he would have been pre teen and early teen during this time Rosemary was making all of this money.
maybe they had a maid and someone to watch frank during this timeframe. but if she was doing all the usual mother/housewife work AND able to run a couple businesses AND play the stock market successfully all I gotta say is she was a helluva time manager.
Mr. P., I've been reading Tex's trial testimony today. It's a lot to get through so I haven't finished it. I had other things to get done.
I thought Gypsy was the first one to give the belladonna root to Tex when he went hay-wire and got arrested and beat up.
He says in his trial testimony that he ingested it the day of the murders down by the waterfall.
I have a feeling that his now deceased attorney, Bill Boyd, coached him on this to have a "not guilty by reason of belladonna insanity" defense.
>>>Johnny said: A million dollars back then equates to about $6 million today.>>>
Exactly Johnny. I don't rule out the "murder for profit" motive in this case. Rosemary was threatening to cut Suzanne off financially if she didn't quit seeing that boyfriend.
Suzanne works in a restaurant making $1.20/hour plus tips. California is an expensive place to live. Rosemary's helping her make ends meet.
They fight and Rosemary's threatening to cut her off.....
I don't know if Rosemary had a maid or not. Frank certainly didn't need a nanny at 15.
And Rosemary most surely had an accountant to do her financials.
Katie
my understanding is that in Tex's testimony he is asked how he got inside the Tate house and he says he went in the front door.
That is counter to what Sadie testified and even counter to what Tex would say in his book years later.
Lynyrd even Charlie said he never saw Tex in his right mind again after Tex ingested Belladonna. If Charlie thinks you're crazy that is high praise. Tex was looking pretty rough at the end. Remember that Tex was one of the "expendables". Belladonna will ruin your mind. The rage and murders began after Belladonna entered the picture. Perhaps Paul Watkins really left Spahn's because of the entrance of Belladonna?
Yes Johnny you're right. Tex was coached for months on what to say at the trial. He didn't go in through the front door.
Tex is a liar. He's been lying since day 1. That's why I like to look at the testimony. It's astoundingly different from the actual events.
In his book, he tries to cover up why he lied, but the whole truth did not come out.
Darn, i hope those tapes come out and have something.
8 plus hours, there has to be something on it.
If Tex testified he went through the front door--and later on he wrote that book--you would think that that he would stay consistent.
Just a little thing.
Johnny, I doubt those tapes will reveal anything...but who knows??? LOL
See you tomorrow night @ Star City Radio! :)
Who's on Star City Radio tomorrow?
I could make that.
Well I'm gonna log off now. I promised today not to blog after 8pm.
Sometimes things don't go right after 8pm and, as Led Zeppelin said, "It's Nobody's Fault But Mine".
And that's okay too.
Talk to you guys tomorrow.
Candy...I hope you're okay.
Tex even denies he had any rope at Cielo in his trial testimony.
What sort of bitch shaves her head for a five foot two schizophrenia? When he's 77 motherfucking years old. Am I not getting something?
Again. I'm asking for your insight.
Everybody wants to get into the act.
I can dig that. But shouldn't the search for truth trump the need for attention?
Well if youre Linsey Lohan tou dress up like Marilyn. But if youre just Star you get a safety pin and a razor and copy Uncle Fester.
http://www.charliemanson.com/places/spahn-map.htm
Does anybody know if a pic exists of the cabin Tex built for Manson in late 68 which Tex drew on a map as being across the highway from the boardwalk at Spahn's?
For some unknown reason Manson told Tex to stop working on it in Dec 68.
Tom, this is what's on Star City Radio tonight:
"July 29 - TONIGHT - Tate-LaBianca Radio Program - 8p ET - We will catch up with Scott Michaels founder of Dearly Departed Tours which features the Helter Skelter Tour. Michaels donates five dollars of each ticket from the Helter Skelter Tour to The Doris Tate Crime Victim Foundation, (iCan) a California-based lobby and crime victim’s organization focusing on victim’s rights and criminal legislation. http://www.dearlydepartedtours.com/helter-skelter-tour.htm"
I hope to see you there!! :)
Sounds like a plan.
Now, back to the Olympics. U S A! U S A!
Women Swimmers have broad shoulders. Anyone else notice that?
(yawn)
Hi Bobby.
As usual..."no sense makes sense". Right? LOL.
Tom I noticed that too about the women swimmers.
I was watching the women volley ball yesterday, and those girls are amazing to watch. They're all extremely fit, they work together like a well-oiled machine, and after every play they come together for a "group hug", whether they score or not. Soooo cute!!! :)
TomG said...
What the hell is wrong with people? And from whence do they take that leap from law abiding citizen to vicious criminal?
when drugs make it so rational thought isnt possible anymore.
So one vote that drugs are the cause....
That's cool, but I think something more is going on.
Star has Obama ears.
Star is just another lost child.
What can you do? Life blows. Then you weaken. Then you die.
But between then and now...let's have a real good time!
Is Star even old enough to vote???
Well over on E-bay they're selling pictures of horseteeth when she was a "princess".
It's yours for only $249.99. LOL.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/LESLIE-VAN-HOUTEN-High-School-Yearbook-Shows-Princess-and-Class-Officer-/280928319702
Well for $20 dollars I have Pizza and wings delivered to my door. And Olympic Games on my Vizio Big Screen TV.
I like horseteeth. But not for 249.99. Girl gone wild, What gets in the head of bitches?
I know I beat this angle to death, but I still think about Manson sitting in his cell 23 hours a day, intelligent enough to realize that next to Hitler his face is probably the second most infamous face of evil for the 20th Century. And Charlie is sitting there thinking, what the hell did I do to deserve this shit. As impossible as it is for most of us to accept, Manson just might be able to convince himself he is not responsible for the horror Tex and the girls did. So all he feels he is guilty of is wounding a drug dealer and slashing a friend. And yet EVIL is his name.
Point being in regard to the subject of this thread, maybe Charlie wants to go out with a bang. What was that comment he made in one of his interviews...."maybe I should have killed five or six hundred then I would have really done something (paraphrased)".
Maybe his two most devoted followers X'ing themselves out isn't just a lark. Maybe Charlie's got one more "fuck you" to society in him and has talked Star and Grey Poupon into doing something. Would any of the old gang help out??? Cappy? Brenda? A little bella donna, Clem?
I would rather they legalize torture, which they aren't very far from doing by the way, than listen to a woman who is trying to be rational.
But that's my shit. Everybody has different thresholds.
Leary this statement is on the Mansondirect.com website, written by Silver Lobo:
Charlie gave us the honor of requesting that we shave our heads and cut our foreheads to mark an X… “for ATWA and all the colors…”
I'm thinking to myself....how does this man have such sway over people???? They considered it an HONOR to shave and mutilate?
I just don't get it. It just doesn't make any sense!
Tom you crack me up! Enjoy your pizza & wings.
I'm watching the Olympics too! :)
Tom said:
"I would rather they legalize torture, which they aren't very far from doing by the way, than listen to a woman who is trying to be rational".
I'm with ya Bro!
You've already got one fantastic quote in the sidebar.
I'm inches from adding that one too! LOL
Katie said:
"I was watching the women volley ball yesterday, and those girls are amazing to watch. They're all extremely fit, they work together like a well-oiled machine, and after every play they come together for a "group hug", whether they score or not. Soooo cute!!! :)"
Yeah...
I'd give my left arm, to be part of one-game's-worth of "group hugs" with those chicks!
LMAO!
TomG said:
"Well for $20 dollars I have Pizza and wings delivered to my door. And Olympic Games on my Vizio Big Screen TV.
I like horseteeth. But not for 249.99. Girl gone wild. What gets in the head of bitches?"
Ahahahaha
I've been trying to answer that question for 25 years!
Lynyrd if you liked that volleyball, you oughtta watch today's event...beach volleyball.
The girls are wearing bikinis, it's 2 girls on 2 girls, instead of "group hugs" they do "girl on girl" hugs, and sometimes they hit each other on the butt. LOL.
"I'm IN"!
Katie... hands-down your best post EVER!
: )
Some things in life are just more important than this case, and women's beach (half-bareass) volleyball, is definitely one of them!
LOLOL
Katie...we go round and round with the mindlessness of TLB, my take is that the "lure of evil" can never make sense to those who don't experience it. There are dozens of books written on Hitler's pull, how he was able to attract and maintain fanatical followers. We tend to be dismissive of Manson's abilities since he can come across as such a comical and inept con man. But the man had/has abilities to charm and seduce people.
If they had only had a volleyball court at Spahn, maybe the family could have worked out their issues that way.
Just kidding of course. Who isn't in favor of female butt slapping.
I never knew the Olympics could be so "titillating". HA HA HA.
Leary one big difference about Hitler is that he used the fact that the German people were suffering, miserable and broke and convinced them that he could change all that. Then when things started changing for them, they were convinced that he was some kinda super hero.
Charlie gathered his herd in a different time. I just don't get why rich young girls would chose to live at that fly-ridden ranch and be treated like hookers.
Unless maybe its because Charlie has the "Kavorka"...like Kramer. HA HA.
Brian Davis did one of the most fantastic interviews tonight ever. His interview with Scott Michaels was AWESOME. It was so informative.
I hope that each and everyone listens to this interview. I think you will really enjoy it!!! :)
Katie
spot on
a heckuva interview with a wonderful guest.
even Scott will admit he is not 'the expert' on this stuff but he provides an interesting perspective. he probably has spent more time at the sites than anyone.
speaking of great interviews, we want to hear your show soon Katie!!!
for the record, brian's show continues to grow.
moving forward. all are welcome to have a say.
i hope everyone from all sides who listened to the show recognized that tonight.
Thanks Johnny!!!
>>>speaking of great interviews, we want to hear your show soon Katie!!!>>>
You're so sweet. Thanks so much!!!
>>For the record, brian's show continues to grow.
moving forward. all are welcome to have a say.
i hope everyone from all sides who listened to the show recognized that tonight.>>>
I'll double that in spades. Everyone is welcome. There are a lot of Anons who don't speak I hope they do next time.
Johnny I appreciate your participation on this blog, and your continued interest in the Star City Radio broadcast.
I know I don't say it enough, but I love you guys!!!
Okay time's up, I have to log off now. Sweet dreams guys.
I wish I could go into Jay's house....
Oh well....
We'll talk tomorrow.....
Does anyone know if Star communicates with Red and Blue and maybe Cappy? One "insider" told me Red has no problem with Star being there in Charlie's life, but somewhere I read Charlie said Star is who he wants to be his wife and his is other half of his Soul ( I always thought RED was!)...
an interesting question, Candy. I have always wondered about communication amongst Family members. Do Gypsy and Grogan, who have a kid together. right?...do they stay in touch? Of course many folk would say it is none of our business who stays in touch, and I suppose that's true. But as been said before, these people made themselves public figures so in many ways they abdicated their right to privacy. Plus some of us are just to damn curious.
Charlie wants to marry Star????
katie: there is a FAcebook community called "The ENERGY OF THE MANSONS" it posted a quote of Charlies about Star how he wants to make her his wife and she is the other half of his soul...let me check if tis still posted there...Ive heard this before from one of Star's "ex" friends he told me the same thing and some other stuff which I wont devulge here...
Wow! That's interesting stuff Candy. I never heard that before....
Leary I've wondered the same thing. Do the family members stay in touch. I can't imagine being involved in something that "tight and intense" back in the 60's and then never communicate again.
um IM not able to find it now it began with something like "after 43 years of prison charles manson has found love and a quote of CM about how he feels about Star then says the rest is private,,,,it may have been removed by now not sure who knows if its real info or not I dont even know who runs this energy of the mansons community to be honest I just joined it few mos ago
katie ya sometime email me ok
Brian Davis's radio show had close to 500 listeners last night. Right at server capacity which is why the sound cut out.
And actually that is good news. Over the last couple weeks a real momentum has been building.
Regarding Lynn (allegedly) getting replaced by Star:
Kinda sucks, 'cuz Lynn Fromme has always been my favorite.
I always found it oddly fascinating... (in a completely bizarre sorta way)... that Manson and I, both chose the same girl. LOL
Lynn deserves to be number one... she's been loyal for decades.
And Now... after all these years... Lynn's been "dethroned"???
Wow... I guess Lynn "went and got old, on him".
AC... is this true?
Does Manson trade-up to younger women... (just like superficial "piggies" do), when his ladies get old?
Is Manson now hung-up on physical appearance like Hollywood and television?
(AC will be here any minute now. LOLOL)
Thanks for the info Candy!
well one of stars "facebook" friends ( i wont name now) had a lengthy conversation on his page with monkeyboy ( james robinson) and theyboth talked how charlie is smart he wont take these old lady groupies he wanted soemone "fresh" ( guess what fresh means?) and monkeyboy went on to say ya I thought leslie VH was the best looking manson girl star has surpassed her anyone who thinks these dudes cares or give a fuck about ATWA is lying we all know better get real
Candy said:
"In 1970-71 to self-mutilate and for a women especially to shave their heads WAS a HUGE statement of "giving up-x'ing from society", nowadays self mutilation tattoos brandings, shaved heads ( all the movie stars do it, alot of friends family of cancer patients do it etc) however a ceremonial gesture... I dont surmise it will "catch the attention of the media".
I agree Candy.
Self-mutilation (in one form or another) is common-place these days... and there are several popular hairstyles out there, that are much more bizzare than the Sinead O'Connor skinhead look.
It's all been done before... and it's all been done, to death.
Heck... there are plenty of folks on facebook alone, who look more bizarre than Star and Gray Wolf. LOL
Bottom line:
A person must go to pretty extreme lengths to "stand-out" now-a-days.
Us TLB enthusiasts are "titillated" by this sorta stuff... (and of course, the underlying message and significance of the "X", can not be ignored).
But... the vast majority of our general public, do not follow this case regularly... and to those mainstream folks... two freaks with a shaved head, and an "X" on their skull, is not a big deal.
I highly doubt, this bizarre display will command much (if any) mainstream media or public attention.
'Course, if 500 folks "carved and shaved" (LOL)... that might grab media attention, and start folks, asking questions. LOL
Any online Manson groups wanna initiate a "Mass Carving" on a large scale? LOLOL
Count me out!
I'm already ugly enough!
AHahahaha
LYnard I as someone who came upon reading Helter Skelter maybe 30 yrs ago wrote to LYn talked to here on the phone and I forever grateful I did learn to appreciate ATWA the joy of growing my own food etc and appreciate our natural resources did put an X on my head several times as they heal fast and now and then a hippie will see it and say oh no:( so Im not diminishing its initial statement by far merely pointing out in this time it might go unoticed undesereved of the meaning because so many are tattooed shaved et al I realize it IS a big thing for any woman wo cut her hair off grey wolf well I mean he was bald anyways not much of a sacrifice for him at least maybe more so for *
to find out * did this didn't shock me more like I had been wondering when she would...
Johnny that's great news! But I hope we don't have trouble in the future with audio. Does Brian know how to fix that????
katie8753 said...
Johnny that's great news! But I hope we don't have trouble in the future with audio. Does Brian know how to fix that????
July 30, 2012 4:19 PM
Well Katie, to quote Richard Dreyfus in the classic scene from Jaws, 'We'll need a bigger boat." Which means Brian will have to allocate more space to that server.
A pleasant problem to have. Too many listeners...
Thanks Johnny. That is a pleasant problem to have.
Last night in the chat room I was talking about Jay Sebring's house and wanting to see the interior.
Anyway, other people expressed an interest, so I wanted to post a link to a thread I did on Jay, which includes a video explaining that Paul Bern built that house for his bride Jean Harlow, then died shortly thereafter. By suicide...or whatever.
Strangely Jean died at the age of 26...same age as Sharon.
Anyway it's the 4th thread down on this link if anyone's interested. The 1st video on the thread is the one about the house.
http://www.lsb3.com/search/label/Jay%20Sebring
all this talk of star replacing squeaky got me thinking. Didnt she finally "denounce" Manson a year or so before she got out of jail? And i believe Sandy did too in recent years. That leaves cappy as the only member of the old family that still would be considered a supporter, and im not sure about that even. Has there been any interviews or anything at all with squeaky since she got out. Ive been waiting not so patiently to hear what she has to say these days.
also ive been going in the radio show chat room the last few weeks too. i couldnt register under andy so im in there under herp3 (my email) seems like a friendly bunch for the most part.
Squeaky has to keep qiet as part of her parole.
she has to be squeeky clean
Hi Andy. I hope you are joining us in the chat room on Sunday night during the broadcasts. I'll be looking for you. :)
I honestly don't know anything about Squeaky or Sandy, where they live, what they think of Manson...I'm not even sure what color goes with what girl. LOL.
It would be interesting to know what ALL the girls think of Star.
Do Leslie & Pat even speak to each other??
Katie
that's always been my question, how much do the girls interact with each other at this point?
tied forever by their actions 4 decades ago...what would happen if they found themselves in a room with tex, bruce and charlie.
would they all revert back to their former roles? or has 4 decades erased all of that.
surely they have visitors that pass info between them...
or at least did for many years.
and now with their parents gone, what kind of relationship do they have with their siblings...what happens when they call their relatives.
'hey mom, it's Aunt Leslie on the phone calling collect, do you want to take the call?'
Johnny there's GOT to be a lot of resentment that Leslie & Pat have for Charlie & Tex.
How much does it suck that those 2 girls have been in prison all these years and the other girls have done their prison time for whatever reason and they're all out now. If I was Leslie or Pat, I don't think I would have a kind word for ANY of the other family members. LOL.
Charlie gave us the honor of requesting that we shave our heads and cut our foreheads to mark an X
The honour? Seriously? Just how sad are these people? They deserve a smack with my spoon.
ALICE!!!! Good to see you!!! :)
Hey Katie! *waves* still around and lurking - just couldn't resist commenting on the very great 'honour' Charlie has bestowed on his latest drones.
>>>Alice said: just couldn't resist commenting on the very great 'honour' Charlie has bestowed on his latest drones.>>>
HA HA HA HA HA!!!
in one of the many books but i cant remember what one, it said pat and leslie talk but not really with susan..whos now dead anyhow
That Alice is sure one cute baby!!
katie8753 said...
Johnny there's GOT to be a lot of resentment that Leslie & Pat have for Charlie & Tex.
How much does it suck that those 2 girls have been in prison all these years and the other girls have done their prison time for whatever reason and they're all out now. If I was Leslie or Pat, I don't think I would have a kind word for ANY of the other family members. LOL.
July 31, 2012 9:49 AM
Or when they hear about Clem out and playing Club Dates...since the mid 80's.
I have a feeling it has been the subject of more than one talk...probably hear a bit of:
Wanna Make Ya Holler from those two girls.
Hi Stormy! I knew you couldn't resist sweet little Alice. LOL.
Think about it Johnny.
Pat, Leslie & Sadie all listened to Charlie's orders from Squeaky, Sandy & Gypsy...shave your head, carve an "x", wear girly dresses, stand up and start singing during court session, laugh at the testimony about murder, fire your attorney, hire this attorney, on my cue stand up and spread your arms and act like you're being crucified, threaten the jury with their own children killing them.
The girls on the sidewalk during the trials, praising Charlie, threatening people, acting crazy.
But in the end, all those girls are free but Pat & Leslie. Sadie's finally free cuz she croaked.
All the other girls are free to have children and grandchildren, enjoying life and acting like nothing ever happened.
Pat and Leslie will never have children or grandchildren.
Their time is gone. I'll just bet there is a lot of "teeth gnashing" about that.
I just wonder if they ever send Charlie poison pen letters.
Even Squeaky is out now after serving an incredible 35 years in prison. 35 years probably sounds like chump change to Pat and Leslie.
http://www.cielodrive.com/spahn-movie-ranch.php
Look at this batch of pics on the fifth row down, 1st on the left.
Is that George Spahn in white with black shoes during the raid on Aug 16?
i'm sure some of the family that has been free all these years carry a lot of guilt about what they were involved in all those years ago.
for some its probably a deep dark secret they've hidden from family and friends.
can you imagine going through life with that kind of secret in your past,just waiting for the day that it pops up and bites you hard on the ass like it did with steve grogan?
Pat and Leslie today, I am almost sure, are pro social.
Many crimes are committed by teenagers who feel they are bulletproof, perhaps personal fable....they can't imagine a world that goes on without them.
But upon maturity, the early 30's, they realize the unspeakable tragedy of the act they committed.
They are more remorseful and spiritual than you and I probably know. Time in a penitentiary leads to much reflection and reaching out to God as they understand.
The sum of a human life is not defined by the worst act they committed.
http://www.cielodrive.com/spahn-movie-ranch.php
Look at the same batch. Fifth row third from left. Why is Charlie wearing a shirt that has been ironed? Is that really Charlie and Decarlo?
i remember reading somewhere (maybe helter skelter) that the raid on spahn ranch was filmed as some sort of training tool for the cops....i'd love to see that.
the films probably forgotten in some dusty lapd file cabinet.
Hey everyone,
This is off the current topic but Star is kinda hot in a plain Jane sorta way. i'd romp her. And she does look very similar to sadie.....weird. But why in the hell would they shave their heads and x themselves 43 years after the fact. Fuckin' loons. But they say crazy girls are the best in the sack so if grey wolf is feeding star the high hard one, I bet he's loving it.
i think shes hot with hair but with her head shaved shes scary looking.
Ye Shiwen is either an awesome mudderblapping swimmer or she is a blood doping cheater. Either way, I love women who SHAKE UP DA WORLD!
SHAKE UP DA WORLD!
i know that gypsy sent leslie a letter stating that she knew the role she had played in leslie's life. i think she does feel guilty for bringing leslie to the family. gypsy also brought linda to manson and probably felt very guilty when she was still with the family.
I suspect that Manson idolizers like Star actually contribute to the fear society has against releasing any of the core killers to TLB which literally insures the continued inprisonment of possibly patolable inmates like Leslie.
Anotherwords, do we really want more Stars in the world? The idolitry to the Manson evil is something the parole board considers. Stars subversive, bizarre behavior doesn't help Leslie.
bobby said...>>>>>
i think shes hot with hair but with her head shaved shes scary looking
I'm with you on that one Matt.
reminds me too much of a Nazi camp victum.<<<<<
I feel the same Bobby. She looks like a Nazi victim. And i think she's wasting her life. Anyone know anything about her background...her parents and family?
I hope without too many regrets, she makes her way back to reality one day. And maybe when she's 40 or 50 years old and Charlie is long dead, she'll get herself to a plastic surgeon, have that x filed filed off her pretty face and begin using her skills and dedication for a cause other than Charlie Manson.
What do these people use for money? How do they support themselves? Social security, welfare, donations? Just wondering...piggie that i am and all, according to Kermit/Jim.
Her coloring isn't as fair, but Star with long hair reminds me of Sondra Locke. Late 70's Sondra Locke...when she hooked up with Clint Eastwood.
Hi Marliese. I was wondering the same thing about Star. I have no idea where she even came from, if she has parents, if she's "missing", if she works, how she and "that man" pay the rent and bills, etc.
She is a pretty girl, but she's terribly misguided. If I was looking for a sugar daddy, I'd make sure he at least had lots of "sugar" to dole out. LOL.
She * is definitely devoted no matter what the reason...
Katie said>>>>>She is a pretty girl, but she's terribly misguided. If I was looking for a sugar daddy, I'd make sure he at least had lots of "sugar" to dole out. LOL.<<<<<
Hi Katie...LOL!
hru Katie:)
Charlie with his hands around a young woman, any young woman, is revolting.
Wonder what horseface and 'she got old on me' Pat would say about this photo?
weird everyone calls LULu horseface she must have had something that she was Bobbys girl cus he was the most handsome of any guys even charlie
Bobby you can see from his art work his music he was very intelligent and handsome I doubt he would have grabbed leslie if he thought she was some ugly gal just my opinion
In an early interview, bobby admits to being with several of the girls...they were awfully cute and i slept with a lot of them...if not those words, close to it. I'm sure he was...with most of them. Well maybe not Pat or the vd soaked Sadie. What anyone found attractive about sadie with her rotten teeth and moustache is beyond me. I guess maybe cause she'd probably do anything...anything at all, no doubt.
But Horseface thought of herself as 'Bobby's girl'..at least she said so once in an interview...but if i had to make a wild guess, i'd say he didn't give a hoot about her and cared more for Kitty. But what do i know.
>>>Candy said: weird everyone calls LULu horseface she must have had something that she was Bobbys girl cus he was the most handsome of any guys even charlie>>>
I call her horseteeth because she has big teeth like a horse. It's especially noticeable in her older pictures because her skin has receded and her teeth show more. LOL.
Katie, i guess she's 'losing collagen' huh. :)
Horseface's skin looks terrible, at least in the parole hearing photos...drugs, sun, decades of cigarettes, institutional food, no supplements, poor skincare etc...I do think it's ridiculous the women can no longer use make up or hair coloring in the prison...but neither can Rosemary LaBianca or Abigail Folger and Sharon Tate.
I'd guess by this time, those things are probably not high priorities for Horseface...imagine she'd just like a little freedom.
ok katie I however am no raving beauty sao I think its kinda tasteless to make of peoples looks Id hate to have someone decipher me they would probably say much worse
katie if you could possibly email me Id like to tell yu something that I dont want to post here
Candy it is tasteless to make fun of someone's looks...unless that someone is a heartless killer. Then it's "no holds barred". LOL.
I don't know your e-mail address. If you want to tell me something, you can send it to Lynyrd and he can forward it to me.
Got a hold of Restless Souls by Lisa Statman but it is all fluff and no substance.
My verdict: it is a highly disingenuous piece of work.
Katie, I have to correct you on something. Paul Bern did not build the house for Jean Harlow. He'd built the house a year or so before their marriage. I think he built it in 1930. The original house didn't even have a kitchen because he didn't like to smell food cooking in the house. It was built with only one bedroom because he considered himself to be a bachelor. Jean did not like the house. For one thing, she thought it was too far out in the sticks, she preferred city life. (why is the theme from "Green Acres" now running through my head??)
Personally, I LOVE that house and if I ever win the lottery, I'm telling the owner to name his price and we will have an LSB get-together at my place! :-)
Thanks Venus. I thought he built it for Jean. Maybe he remodeled it before they married.
If you win the lottery....I'm holding you to that promise! HA HA.
Katie, if I win the lottery, you and I will have a slumber party to check out all of the house's nooks and crannies so we can give proper tours to the rest of the gang.
From all of my research on the house, it wasn't really remodeled before she moved in. By most accounts, she rarely stayed there, she stayed in town at another house which was on Club View Drive. At least, that's the address that pops into my mind.
Sam Marx wrote a great book about the death of Paul Bern which has a great description of the house's interior. He was in it while it was being built and during Paul's lifetime plus he was one of the ones who helped with the cover-up following his death.
(I feel another thread coming on between the 2 of us.......)
>>>Katie, if I win the lottery, you and I will have a slumber party to check out all of the house's nooks and crannies so we can give proper tours to the rest of the gang.>>>
HA HA HA. You are definitely on girlfriend!!
>>>(I feel another thread coming on between the 2 of us.......)>>>
Sounds good to me!
Hey Venus, check this out:
http://www.geocities.ws/cactus_st/article/article170.html
Venus what's the name of Sam's book? Surely a kitchen was added on at some point. Who'd want to buy it?
The book is called "Deadly Illusions: Jean Harlow and the Murder of Paul Bern." I highly recommend it.
I don't remember when a kitchen was added. His housekeeper fixed food in the servan't quarters.
Don't forget to bring the Dr. Pepper and popcorn for the slumber party! I'll buy the pizza!!
That link was pretrty interesting, Katie!
Jay was living in the house before 1967 tho. Some say he moved in in 1960. Supposedly, he and Cami lived there together. I've also heard that he'd bought it in 1963.
Venus, that link says that Jay was renting that house. That he was planning to meet with the owners on August 10th to buy it.
I thought he owned it??? Do you know?
>>>Bobby said: I cant beleive I couldnt get more than a yawn from Tom G when I posted this info. It is current Manson ideolgy that clearly demonstrates his racist views.
Is that the problem, current proof that Mansons's racism wants the America of slaves to win out over America post slavery is to much of a contraversy ?
He is teaching a young recruit like Star that Slave America was the good America, then Abe came along and ruined it.>>>
Baby, we all know that Manson is a racist. If anyone doesn't know that, they need to go back to Grade 1.
Bobby, everyone knows that Star is, how shall I say it...less than smart...to listen to Charlie.
I don't know how else to say it. I can't put it any nicer.
She's evidently a girl who just glommed onto a notorious killer and wanted a name for herself.
It happens all the time. Look at all the others...Ted Bundy...Richard Ramirez....Scott Peterson....OJ Simpson....Machine Gun Kelley....Tex Watson...Bruce Davis....Bobby B.....the list just goes on and on.
There will always be women out there who glom onto killers because they don't have a life.
BTW, Tex's wife left him, Bruce's wife left him, and I think Bobby's wife left him too.
Let the record speak for itself.
And Star is no different....
So please don't bother yourself with such nonsense. It doesn't change anything....It is what it is.
Mr. P., I already gave my opinion of Restless Souls. I'll just leave it at that.... :)
In the Olympic News, the USA team of girls in the Volleyball competition beat the Chinese today! They're undefeated!
High five!!! Group Hug!!! Sooooo cute!!! :)
Yes Katie I read your critique. it was more interesting than Staman's book. It's been a long time since I've read a major publication that was that bad. Truly a disgrace for a major publisher to print such fabrique'. A book like Staman's is bad for stores like Bookamillion and BarnesnNoble. Bad for business is what Restless Souls is.
I watched that game between the US and the Chinese girls and it was definitely a match. It was 1/1 until 29 points, then the US finally won.
Kudos to the Chinese. They did a great job. :) A Worthy opponent.!!
Mr. P., I appreciate your opinion, but let's not stir up more trouble. It is what it is.
There's been more than enough trouble with this book....
Enough!!
If you want to post negative comments on this book, please go to Amazon. They will accept it.
You must understand that we had a Jihad about this (myself included), and it needs to die.
Please stop bringing it up. If you want to comment, go to Amazon.
The Drew Peterson trial is underway and the defense tried to call a mistrial today. HA HA.
This guy is a cop that has had at least 4 wives, and the 3RD one died in the bathtub and the 4th one disappeared.
This guy is another Charles Manson. He gets these good looking girls to marry him and him and then he kills them.
Stay tuned....
this is what i know about star---
her real name is afton burton and she is the oldest of four. she grew up in illinois. her parents are religious and conservative. she was a sunday church attender. she had to sneak around as she was expected to spend most of her teenage years in her bedroom. at age 16 she recieved from a friend a piece of paper with manson quotes on it. she started writing manson and is now his lead cheerleader.
Katie you probably wont understand if I did email you since you didnt even know the colors of ATWA
>>Candy said: Katie you probably wont understand if I did email you since you didnt even know the colors of ATWA>>>
Well if it has to do with the colors, no I don't understand it.
Sorry Charlie...
Candy if you have something important to impart, please let me know!
Thanks Beauders. That's creepy but whatever.
I'm going to the house. It's after my bedtime....
katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand
katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand
>>>katie I recall I was also the one who called you out when yu posted some movie film pic of susan and claimed it was Sadie ( some actress with a mugshot who we all knew was not susan) touche' insofar as important ...I think that says enough about your "knowledge" of this subject at hand>>>
Candy, your language is enough to out you. You continually mis-spell words!!!
And your point is what?
I already acquiesced to the fact that I had the wrong avatar. You're beating a dead horse.
You and yours are still stupid....
Sorry I can't help you get smarter...not you nor your girl Starr.....Getty-up. HA HA.
Candy I wish I could teach you how to speak the King's English, but I can't because you're tongue-tied by some barrette that you've embedded in your flesh.
You are one of those unintelligible freaks that posts on these blogs.
Fuck HUGH!!!!
This punk tried to engage me, but she failed.
I'll tell you what...a lot try to engage me...
But they fail.
I'll reiterate...the USA won tonight.
If anyone has questions, call me.
yes, i agree katie star's story is very creepy.
Bobby, I am confused. Shaving your head & making yourself look like my dog's scrotal sack = saving the earth from polluters? How is that going to save the earth from polluters? Is she going to stuff all the hair she shaved off herself, and stuff the world's factory and sewage discharge pipes?? Do pubies count?
On Drew Peterson, reminds me of the old joke:
i'm widowed three times.
wife #1 died from eating poisonous mushrooms
that's terrible
yes,wife #2 died from eating poisonous mushrooms
omg
oh yes
and wife #3? did she die from mushrooms?
no, blow to the head
she wouldn't eat the mushrooms
Stormy, that's pretty good!! LOL.
Well the judge didn't grant the mistrial plea, so it's full steam ahead. That guy's gotta be guilty. 1 wife accidentally bashed her head open in the bathtub and another wife just vanished. Hmmmm......
Katie, all I can say for sure about Jay's house is that it was part of his estate and was sold after his death. He clearly owned it at the time of his death. I don't kow exactly when he moved in. I've seen it reported as anywhere from 1960 to 1963. He clearly lived in it when he started dating Sharon because she had that spooky experience there, remember?
Sorry Bobby. I didn't mean to poo poo your comment. I didn't mean it that way....sorry if it came across that way.
You're right, any Manson followers need to know the truth about him. But the sad thing is they don't like to hear the truth about that monster.
Yes Venus I remember that experience Sharon had. I'm going to try to find the book you mentioned at the library. I'd like to read it.
Thanks Venus!!
Bobby you're right. Manson is clearly a racist. He had this whole baloney story that he fed his followers back then the blacks would be too stupid to rule the world. And he didn't like Shorty's wife because she was black.
I hate it that I hurt your feelings..... (:
Hi Bob.
I enjoyed the information, that you provided.
I just didn't have anything worthwhile, to add.
Bobby when you said that about the Washington/Lincoln voting on that website, I went over there to see it, and I saw that stupid statement about how these two were "honored" that Manson requested that they mutilate themselves and I was too disgusted to read further.
If anyone sends money to Manson they're not too clever. There's an old saying "a fool and his money are soon parted". I think that covers it. LOL.
katie: the reason I wanted to email you waas to mention some things I didnt want to post in main until I had some confirmation and wanted your opinion...insofar as the KIngs English not sure where that came from...and Star Ive never met her in my life nor spoke to her I guess only person I know of who has is AC
katie I only wanted to email yu about something I heard of star and wanted confirmation before I posted
Candy with all due respect that should be afforded to any blogger, I really don't understand what you require of me.
You made a comment that I don't know anything about this case, and then you make another comment wanting my opinion. That doesn't make any sense to me.
I can't e-mail you because I don't know your e-mail address, an issue that I already went over. Moreover, I have no information about Star because Star is some girl who decided to follow Gypsum for reasons unknown.
I haven't followed this segment because it doesn't interest me...PERIOD. It has nothing to do with solving this case. If aspects of this case don't interest me, I don't follow up on it.
I don't know how to make that more clear. I won't e-mail you. Please stop asking me to.
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